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	<title>Comments on: More On The Global Warming Myth</title>
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	<link>http://www.waterpup.com/more-on-the-global-warming-myth/</link>
	<description>California SportFishing, Yellowtail Fishing, Anything Southern California</description>
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		<title>By: waterpup</title>
		<link>http://www.waterpup.com/more-on-the-global-warming-myth/comment-page-1/#comment-981</link>
		<dc:creator>waterpup</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Sep 2009 19:47:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.waterpup.com/?p=201#comment-981</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s a  thoughtful post you&#039;ve made but also repetitive to what those that believe in Global Warming say ALL THE TIME.
Same holds true here &quot;Just because you say or repeat something, doesn&#039;t make it true&quot;.

The only facts we can prove is that earth has gone through warming and cooling cycles. We cannot prove that we are going burn up or turn into popsicles.
Keeping the earth clean and pollution free is the only thing we can truly change. Not for global warming concerns but because it&#039;s a beautiful place and we should treat it right.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s a  thoughtful post you&#8217;ve made but also repetitive to what those that believe in Global Warming say ALL THE TIME.<br />
Same holds true here &#8220;Just because you say or repeat something, doesn&#8217;t make it true&#8221;.</p>
<p>The only facts we can prove is that earth has gone through warming and cooling cycles. We cannot prove that we are going burn up or turn into popsicles.<br />
Keeping the earth clean and pollution free is the only thing we can truly change. Not for global warming concerns but because it&#8217;s a beautiful place and we should treat it right.</p>
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		<title>By: Strangely Perfect</title>
		<link>http://www.waterpup.com/more-on-the-global-warming-myth/comment-page-1/#comment-980</link>
		<dc:creator>Strangely Perfect</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Sep 2009 19:31:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.waterpup.com/?p=201#comment-980</guid>
		<description>Just because you say or repeat something, does not make it true...

Quote;
&quot;...now infamous hockey stick chart, they played with the model and found that no matter what data they put in, it always produced a hockey stick&quot;

...is actually an absolute lie and fabrication.  

The converse was and is true.  

The models were played with and the only scenario of data inputs that matched the hockey stick (initially noticed by HH Lamb et al and since expanded with ice-core data etc) was that climate forcing is due to human activities since the industrial era of a massive increase in CO2 output from a host of sources, not just fuel burning but also changes in farming etc due to an exponential growth in human population.

All the other postulations are just red-herrings and extra lies.  For instance, the northern ice-cap is showing unprecedented collapse and shrinkage that has only recently been halted by the recent El Nino event.  Give it a year or two and it&#039;ll be back on.  Justifying natural ice-shelving as a counterpoint to the global warming evidence is just plain pathetic.
The same goes for the global retreat of glaciers.  It&#039;s all plain, progressive and increasing evidence of a global temperature rise.  The only difference between now and the last time this happened ~11k years ago is the recent (in geological terms) increase in people and their CO2 outputs, either directly or indirectly.

Since this inter-glacial started, (with a massive global warming), it overshot and natural feedback effects led to a mini ice age of ~1000 length in Europe &amp; N America, before the general slow stasis of the last 10k years that we&#039;ve experienced.  There is no argument over the feedback and forcing effects.  The argument is over the current rapid changes and their cause.  CO2, methane and low-level aerosols, all are products of human activity and are the prime suspects.
Ice ages are due to a combination of orbital changes and continental drift that either promote or demote the creation of polar ice sheets, dependant on where they are.  The starting temperatures for these changes come from solar output, which fortunately for us, doesn&#039;t change much.
Because of the above, the temperature flips between two or more stable states.  It&#039;s the flipping that&#039;s dangerous to us as a civilisation, not the absolute levels.   A few humans will always survive virtually any disaster, but civilisations don&#039;t.  And the evidence is that we are in a flipping cycle right now.

Accept the facts.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just because you say or repeat something, does not make it true&#8230;</p>
<p>Quote;<br />
&#8220;&#8230;now infamous hockey stick chart, they played with the model and found that no matter what data they put in, it always produced a hockey stick&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8230;is actually an absolute lie and fabrication.  </p>
<p>The converse was and is true.  </p>
<p>The models were played with and the only scenario of data inputs that matched the hockey stick (initially noticed by HH Lamb et al and since expanded with ice-core data etc) was that climate forcing is due to human activities since the industrial era of a massive increase in CO2 output from a host of sources, not just fuel burning but also changes in farming etc due to an exponential growth in human population.</p>
<p>All the other postulations are just red-herrings and extra lies.  For instance, the northern ice-cap is showing unprecedented collapse and shrinkage that has only recently been halted by the recent El Nino event.  Give it a year or two and it&#8217;ll be back on.  Justifying natural ice-shelving as a counterpoint to the global warming evidence is just plain pathetic.<br />
The same goes for the global retreat of glaciers.  It&#8217;s all plain, progressive and increasing evidence of a global temperature rise.  The only difference between now and the last time this happened ~11k years ago is the recent (in geological terms) increase in people and their CO2 outputs, either directly or indirectly.</p>
<p>Since this inter-glacial started, (with a massive global warming), it overshot and natural feedback effects led to a mini ice age of ~1000 length in Europe &amp; N America, before the general slow stasis of the last 10k years that we&#8217;ve experienced.  There is no argument over the feedback and forcing effects.  The argument is over the current rapid changes and their cause.  CO2, methane and low-level aerosols, all are products of human activity and are the prime suspects.<br />
Ice ages are due to a combination of orbital changes and continental drift that either promote or demote the creation of polar ice sheets, dependant on where they are.  The starting temperatures for these changes come from solar output, which fortunately for us, doesn&#8217;t change much.<br />
Because of the above, the temperature flips between two or more stable states.  It&#8217;s the flipping that&#8217;s dangerous to us as a civilisation, not the absolute levels.   A few humans will always survive virtually any disaster, but civilisations don&#8217;t.  And the evidence is that we are in a flipping cycle right now.</p>
<p>Accept the facts.</p>
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		<title>By: waterpup</title>
		<link>http://www.waterpup.com/more-on-the-global-warming-myth/comment-page-1/#comment-840</link>
		<dc:creator>waterpup</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Oct 2008 18:36:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.waterpup.com/?p=201#comment-840</guid>
		<description>Is that a like mind type of thing or is he literally using your work? I&#039;m hoping like mind thing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is that a like mind type of thing or is he literally using your work? I&#8217;m hoping like mind thing.</p>
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		<title>By: Stephen Wilde</title>
		<link>http://www.waterpup.com/more-on-the-global-warming-myth/comment-page-1/#comment-826</link>
		<dc:creator>Stephen Wilde</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Sep 2008 20:58:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.waterpup.com/?p=201#comment-826</guid>
		<description>The article from Professor Duffy draws haevily on my work as follows:

Global Warming and Cooling- The Reality (Wilde)

 Climate Change-The Real Causes  (Duffy)


The presence of the sun must be a much bigger influence on global temperatures than the greenhouse characteristics of CO2 on it?s own. (Wilde)

The sun clearly must be a much bigger influence on global temperatures than any of the greenhouse gases   (Duffy)



The greenhouse effect, as a whole, may smooth out rises and falls in temperature from other causes (Wilde)

the ?greenhouse effect? acts as a mechanism to smooth out fluctuations or rises and falls in temperature  (Duffy)




The greenhouse effect is mainly a phenomenon of the land surface and the atmosphere  (Duffy)

The greenhouse effect is mainly a phenomenon of the land surface and the atmosphere (Wilde)


The strongest sunlight reaching the Earth is around the Equator that is primarily oceanic. The equatorial sun puts heat into the system year in year out whereas loss of heat is primarily via the poles with each alternating as the main heat loser depending on time of year.  (Wilde)

The sun?s energy at the equator is consistent all year round, and in this region the larger proportion of surface area happens to be the ocean water.  The dominant heat loss is primarily at the poles with each pole alternating as the main loser of heat. (Duffy)


I believe that ENSO switches from warming to cooling mode depending on whether the sun is having a net warming or net cooling effect on the Earth. Thus the sun directly drives the ENSO cycle and the ENSO cycle directly drives global temperature changes. Indeed, the effect appears to be much more rapid than anyone has previously believed  (Wilde)

The sun directly drives the El Nino?El Nina current motions that drive temperature changes world-wide
( Duffy)

The El Nino Southern Oscillation (ENSO cycle) turns from warming to cooling depending on the net warming or cooling effect of the sun. This occurs quite rapidly  

(Duffy)


there are similar periodic oscillations in other oceans such as the Atlantic and the Arctic  (Wilde)

Also there are similar periodic oscillations in other oceans (Atlantic and the Arctic oceans). (Duffy)


When we compare that with land masses, a lower proportion of heat is reflected from watery zones to participate in the greenhouse effect.  (Duffy)

more of the incoming heat is absorbed by water as compared to land and a lower proportion is reflected to participate in the greenhouse effect (Wilde)


The heat from the sun varies over a number of solar cycles which can last from about 9.5 years to about 13.6 years (the main one is the cycle of 11 years).  The earth also has an irregular orbit around the sun. These and other effects like the gravitational effects of the planets of the solar system, combine to affect the sun?s magnetic field. Solar fares and sunspots affect the amount of heat generated from the sun
(Duffy)

The heat from the sun varies over a number of interlinked and overlapping cycles but the main one is the cycle of 11 years or so. That solar cycle can last from about 9.5 years to about 13.6 years and appears to be linked to the gravitational effects of the planets of the solar system combining to affect the sun?s magnetic field which seems then to influence the amount of heat generated and incidentally affects the number of sunspots (Wilde)


There is more, some from other articles but one gets the picture.

My original articles can be found here :


http://co2sceptics.com/news.php?tag=stephen+wilde</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The article from Professor Duffy draws haevily on my work as follows:</p>
<p>Global Warming and Cooling- The Reality (Wilde)</p>
<p> Climate Change-The Real Causes  (Duffy)</p>
<p>The presence of the sun must be a much bigger influence on global temperatures than the greenhouse characteristics of CO2 on it?s own. (Wilde)</p>
<p>The sun clearly must be a much bigger influence on global temperatures than any of the greenhouse gases   (Duffy)</p>
<p>The greenhouse effect, as a whole, may smooth out rises and falls in temperature from other causes (Wilde)</p>
<p>the ?greenhouse effect? acts as a mechanism to smooth out fluctuations or rises and falls in temperature  (Duffy)</p>
<p>The greenhouse effect is mainly a phenomenon of the land surface and the atmosphere  (Duffy)</p>
<p>The greenhouse effect is mainly a phenomenon of the land surface and the atmosphere (Wilde)</p>
<p>The strongest sunlight reaching the Earth is around the Equator that is primarily oceanic. The equatorial sun puts heat into the system year in year out whereas loss of heat is primarily via the poles with each alternating as the main heat loser depending on time of year.  (Wilde)</p>
<p>The sun?s energy at the equator is consistent all year round, and in this region the larger proportion of surface area happens to be the ocean water.  The dominant heat loss is primarily at the poles with each pole alternating as the main loser of heat. (Duffy)</p>
<p>I believe that ENSO switches from warming to cooling mode depending on whether the sun is having a net warming or net cooling effect on the Earth. Thus the sun directly drives the ENSO cycle and the ENSO cycle directly drives global temperature changes. Indeed, the effect appears to be much more rapid than anyone has previously believed  (Wilde)</p>
<p>The sun directly drives the El Nino?El Nina current motions that drive temperature changes world-wide<br />
( Duffy)</p>
<p>The El Nino Southern Oscillation (ENSO cycle) turns from warming to cooling depending on the net warming or cooling effect of the sun. This occurs quite rapidly  </p>
<p>(Duffy)</p>
<p>there are similar periodic oscillations in other oceans such as the Atlantic and the Arctic  (Wilde)</p>
<p>Also there are similar periodic oscillations in other oceans (Atlantic and the Arctic oceans). (Duffy)</p>
<p>When we compare that with land masses, a lower proportion of heat is reflected from watery zones to participate in the greenhouse effect.  (Duffy)</p>
<p>more of the incoming heat is absorbed by water as compared to land and a lower proportion is reflected to participate in the greenhouse effect (Wilde)</p>
<p>The heat from the sun varies over a number of solar cycles which can last from about 9.5 years to about 13.6 years (the main one is the cycle of 11 years).  The earth also has an irregular orbit around the sun. These and other effects like the gravitational effects of the planets of the solar system, combine to affect the sun?s magnetic field. Solar fares and sunspots affect the amount of heat generated from the sun<br />
(Duffy)</p>
<p>The heat from the sun varies over a number of interlinked and overlapping cycles but the main one is the cycle of 11 years or so. That solar cycle can last from about 9.5 years to about 13.6 years and appears to be linked to the gravitational effects of the planets of the solar system combining to affect the sun?s magnetic field which seems then to influence the amount of heat generated and incidentally affects the number of sunspots (Wilde)</p>
<p>There is more, some from other articles but one gets the picture.</p>
<p>My original articles can be found here :</p>
<p><a href="http://co2sceptics.com/news.php?tag=stephen+wilde">http://co2sceptics.com/news.php?tag=stephen+wilde</a></p>
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